Perhaps. Ah, but the person who programmed you, or the machine that made you gave you preferences. Those would be the preferences belonging to your creator, so now we have to consider this: are those preferences real? Or are they also an illusion? Does it matter, who it comes from? A machine, a man, a god? Haha.
[He raises his shoulders in a shrug.]
Both, I would think. They feed into each other. The role cannot exist without society needing it. And society requires the information I uncover to help it thrive by catching killers who pose a risk to it.
Well. If even those preferences aren't real, then how are you to say that any of them are?
[ no one: absolutely no one at all: these two: what is a man ]
Conversely, if none of it is real, and all of it is simply a constraint made and enforced by someone, something else... then are you truly so different from anyone else?
Hm. What are you then, if you're an abstraction away from presumably the rest of humanity?
[ mildly. ]
Don't tell me they had mind-mapping technology already, where you're from ... Ah, but if it's faulty and prototypical, then that might explain your amnesia, hm?
The technology was faulty in this case, you'd just be a byproduct. And just because a mindmap is made, doesn't mean it has to be used... though I suppose in this case you really would be a ghost, considering that mindmaps don't just simply gain cognizance.
[ you can use them as the basis to stick into [redacted] but they're not going to become even remotely sentient, let alone sapient, on their own. ]
I wonder. Perhaps you really would relate more to us Dolls after all. Idiosyncrasies and traits that don't make sense even to yourself, yet you're helplessly beholden to them. That's correct, isn't it?
Relate to you? Hm, I think so. I have often felt, when talking to you, that you might understand my situation better than most. [Not that he's a robot, but...] And yes! You got that right. I feel like...a mold has been crafted for me, and I've been shoved into it, regardless whether its a good fit for me or not. I have to function as the form wants me to.
[ a long, thoughtful hum, followed by a moment of silence. then: ]
I'll tell you what someone once told me: "Even Dolls can change."
... It's quite optimistic, isn't it? What does it even really mean? There are things we can change about ourselves, but nothing like that. Short of formatting ourselves, nothing can be done about those intrinsic qualities, whether we like it or not...
What is "change", really? Changing qualities about ourselves, but those changes are still within the frameworks we're programmed with...then is that change at all?
[Is it not change unless one moves past the limitations, or does it still count?]
But yes. We continue, and try, and do our best, we do.
I suppose that question depends on whether or not we're everything our creators intended for us to be at once. They set bounds and parameters for us, but are we ever truly living up to them?
If we're already straining against all the limits placed for us, and there's no room to grow further, perhaps we can't change after all. But if we're reconfiguring ourselves within the constraints of our forms and cages ... Well.
It isn't a static system, at least?
[ but does that count as change enough, in the circumstances that they're in. ]
Its change within the system. A fish in a bowl can move a pebble from one side to another. But it can't change the bowl its in. I suppose that's change in a form, but...I think what we're both getting at that its not quite meaningful change. At least, not to people watching us from the outside. It only means something to us.
If it walks like a person, talks like a person, and thinks like a person, is it one? Haha, but of course, I'm telling this to someone who is made in the facsimile of a human being, who has her own thoughts, but is not a human at all.
[A shake of the head.]
Ahaha. Then I don't know. I think to a certain select group of people, I'm not.
Less than being human, I'm not even a person. Not as far as those in the context of my own world go. Imitation isn't being, and that's what I'm considered. It is hard for humanity to forget what they created their tools for.
Though I suppose humanity would happily dehumanize many things if it would be useful to them.
[ whatever nic was, the burnish... whatever concerns anaido and his role. matters of convenience, hm? ]
I guess here's a question. Is a hologram that is being programmed and put into action by a human being a human itself, or no? The intent is there, but the body is fake, but the thoughts the hologram has are human thoughts, right? But I think you would have some people who would say "the hologram is not human" regardless. So in the end...I think being human is...all the parts belonging to a whole. If you leave something out, then that definition can't exactly be applied as easily.
If we apply that in reverse, then does that mean we are lacking something if we're not human?
[ she studies the flowers idly. ]
I'm not sure that illustration really applies, though. A hologram is simply a direct reflection of the actions someone else is taking somewhere. It isn't an independent entity, processing decisions that might be the same as someone else's. You might as well point at a portrait on the wall and ask "is this human?"
Hm? Perhaps, perhaps not. Maybe the other way around, and we're beyond human. What do you think?
[He smirks at 45, before letting out a low chuckle.]
Are you calling me the shadow in Plato's Cave? [And another laugh.] Ah, but not to make it about me. In a way, that's true. A reflection is not its own living breathing human. But if it was given autonomy, in a way that, let's say, it contains part of the psyche of the original, and can act on its own...well. Still not quite human, right? It's only a facsimile of one.
How can we be beyond human if we play by their rules and follow their laws?
[ a mild, handwavy gesture. ]
It's a copy, existing divergent from its template and original self. What an interesting notion. I thought humans would be too afraid of artificial life like that gaining awareness of itself and any form of independence to truly toy with the idea overmuch.
In the way that while an audience member is stuck in the seats of the theater, and is an integral part of it, they may see things the characters on the stage are not aware of. Perhaps? Perhaps...
[A light shrug.]
That's why there's failsafes, usually. But if something is broken, if there's a glitch, if there's something missing...sometimes, it gets overlooked, you know? To err is human, after all.
... isn't the other half of that saying, 'to forgive is divine'? And yet they sanctify humanity instead.
Can't say I don't know what it's like to be something overlooked, though. A glitch in the system, a problem to be taken care of... but only if they know it exists.
A squad shrouded in mystery. ▓▓▓▓▒ has met them once, and others can only guess at the members' identities from rumors. Members of the squad all have advanced AI and high capacity for independent operation. Rumor has it that Squad 404 usually deals with ░▓▒▓▓▓▒▓▓▒▒▒░░
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no subject
Date: 2020-07-16 11:57 pm (UTC)And what shackles you so, hm? The constraints of society, or the role you're meant to play?
[ novel metaphor, and all. ]
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 12:04 am (UTC)[He raises his shoulders in a shrug.]
Both, I would think. They feed into each other. The role cannot exist without society needing it. And society requires the information I uncover to help it thrive by catching killers who pose a risk to it.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 12:33 am (UTC)[ no one:
absolutely no one at all:
these two: what is a man ]
Conversely, if none of it is real, and all of it is simply a constraint made and enforced by someone, something else... then are you truly so different from anyone else?
[ ah, society. ]
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 12:41 am (UTC)[And a nod.]
Haha, that's true! I'm just another layer of unreal, if that's the case.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 12:57 am (UTC)[ mildly. ]
Don't tell me they had mind-mapping technology already, where you're from ... Ah, but if it's faulty and prototypical, then that might explain your amnesia, hm?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 01:02 am (UTC)[How spooky.]
Perhaps! Or maybe it's just me, if that really was that type of scenario.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 01:16 am (UTC)[ spooky indeed. ]
Hmm. Do you really think of yourself as so different from other humans, Anaido?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 01:25 am (UTC)[He winks.]
Of course I do. Sometimes it feels like a tricky sort of god decided to mess around with my mind as a joke to me and everyone else.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 01:39 am (UTC)[ you can use them as the basis to stick into [redacted] but they're not going to become even remotely sentient, let alone sapient, on their own. ]
I wonder. Perhaps you really would relate more to us Dolls after all. Idiosyncrasies and traits that don't make sense even to yourself, yet you're helplessly beholden to them. That's correct, isn't it?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-17 01:52 am (UTC)[hehehe]
Relate to you? Hm, I think so. I have often felt, when talking to you, that you might understand my situation better than most. [Not that he's a robot, but...] And yes! You got that right. I feel like...a mold has been crafted for me, and I've been shoved into it, regardless whether its a good fit for me or not. I have to function as the form wants me to.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-18 04:00 am (UTC)I'll tell you what someone once told me: "Even Dolls can change."
... It's quite optimistic, isn't it? What does it even really mean? There are things we can change about ourselves, but nothing like that. Short of formatting ourselves, nothing can be done about those intrinsic qualities, whether we like it or not...
Yet we persist nonetheless, don't we?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-18 04:12 am (UTC)[Is it not change unless one moves past the limitations, or does it still count?]
But yes. We continue, and try, and do our best, we do.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-18 05:54 am (UTC)If we're already straining against all the limits placed for us, and there's no room to grow further, perhaps we can't change after all. But if we're reconfiguring ourselves within the constraints of our forms and cages ... Well.
It isn't a static system, at least?
[ but does that count as change enough, in the circumstances that they're in. ]
no subject
Date: 2020-07-18 02:21 pm (UTC)[A nod.]
Its change within the system. A fish in a bowl can move a pebble from one side to another. But it can't change the bowl its in. I suppose that's change in a form, but...I think what we're both getting at that its not quite meaningful change. At least, not to people watching us from the outside. It only means something to us.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-19 04:41 pm (UTC)What a troublesome thing.
[ ... ]
Anaido, would you say that you're considered a person?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-19 05:08 pm (UTC)[There's a twinkle in his eye.]
If it walks like a person, talks like a person, and thinks like a person, is it one? Haha, but of course, I'm telling this to someone who is made in the facsimile of a human being, who has her own thoughts, but is not a human at all.
[A shake of the head.]
Ahaha. Then I don't know. I think to a certain select group of people, I'm not.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-19 07:44 pm (UTC)Though I suppose humanity would happily dehumanize many things if it would be useful to them.
[ whatever nic was, the burnish... whatever concerns anaido and his role. matters of convenience, hm? ]
no subject
Date: 2020-07-19 10:56 pm (UTC)[Anaido smiles to himself, briefly.]
They think it makes them more human, to treat tools as less than human. How ironic is that.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-20 05:50 am (UTC)Ah, but if you're ostensibly human, and not treated as such... To you, what does being human mean?
no subject
Date: 2020-07-20 12:21 pm (UTC)[Hmmmm.]
I guess here's a question. Is a hologram that is being programmed and put into action by a human being a human itself, or no? The intent is there, but the body is fake, but the thoughts the hologram has are human thoughts, right? But I think you would have some people who would say "the hologram is not human" regardless. So in the end...I think being human is...all the parts belonging to a whole. If you leave something out, then that definition can't exactly be applied as easily.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-22 05:35 am (UTC)[ she studies the flowers idly. ]
I'm not sure that illustration really applies, though. A hologram is simply a direct reflection of the actions someone else is taking somewhere. It isn't an independent entity, processing decisions that might be the same as someone else's. You might as well point at a portrait on the wall and ask "is this human?"
no subject
Date: 2020-07-22 11:41 am (UTC)[He smirks at 45, before letting out a low chuckle.]
Are you calling me the shadow in Plato's Cave? [And another laugh.] Ah, but not to make it about me. In a way, that's true. A reflection is not its own living breathing human. But if it was given autonomy, in a way that, let's say, it contains part of the psyche of the original, and can act on its own...well. Still not quite human, right? It's only a facsimile of one.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-22 09:33 pm (UTC)[ a mild, handwavy gesture. ]
It's a copy, existing divergent from its template and original self. What an interesting notion. I thought humans would be too afraid of artificial life like that gaining awareness of itself and any form of independence to truly toy with the idea overmuch.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-22 09:49 pm (UTC)[A light shrug.]
That's why there's failsafes, usually. But if something is broken, if there's a glitch, if there's something missing...sometimes, it gets overlooked, you know? To err is human, after all.
no subject
Date: 2020-07-23 03:57 am (UTC)Can't say I don't know what it's like to be something overlooked, though. A glitch in the system, a problem to be taken care of... but only if they know it exists.
(no subject)
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